Vauxhall gearbox

[Hayling mini]

I notice on some of the Suzuki forums talk about fitting a Vauxhall gearbox to the G13B, does anyone have more info on this?

[miniswift]

Hi Jerry,

It's me again.
Yes you can fit GM gearbox to G13B with modified bell housing.
You can buy them for about £150 or so.
If you do this, you can buy Nova Quaife SCCR gearbox with ATB LSD for £700-800 second hand.

You will need new driveshafts made.

I think If you ask Bill Falkner up in Scotland, you can find out about it.

There are some people with Nova with G13B engine modified by him.


Cheers
Atchi

[Hayling mini]

Hi Atchi
Once again you know the answer :lol:
I have a spare Nova F13 box in my garage so this could be used for testing, do you have any contact details?
Maybe this could solve my problems :lol:

[Swiftmini]

the spigot is the same size and you can use a nova clutch plate with suzi flywheel and pressure plate.

as atchi said you need new shafts, you also need to remove a small amount of block material for cv clearance.

you can fix the lot together with an adapter plate or a cut and shut bellhousing.

hope this helps :)

kev

[DarrenW]

What is the benefits of doing this?

And is the vauxhall gearbox bigger, so would it be a problem fitting it in a mini?

Just interested :oops: :oops:

[MattG]

i guess its because its stronger , and easily available.

if going down this route it would be simpler to start with a 1.6 vauxhall subframe , 3 out of 4 mounts are on the gearbox allread ,you would just need to make 1 more engine mout. drive shafts are std mini/vauxhall items

Matt

[Hayling mini]

Thanks for all your comments, this sounds like it could be a good option. The gearboxs are available at a decent price & the drive shafts are an off the shelf product, so no need to weld two together. I would rather buy an adapter plate / kit than do my own.
The reason I am looking at this is due to the limitation of the Swift box, I am looking to Turbo my Swift Mini. The Vauxhall box is supposed to handle much more power & LSD etc are available off the shelf :lol:

[speedy]

maybe even a sixspeed box from a calibra 4x4???? :twisted:

[MattG]

6 speed is only worth the bragging rights i am afraid , as the 6th speed ratio is no better than a 5th , also its a different casting case , so more work is needed

Matt

[Swiftmini]

"I would rather buy an adapter plate / kit than do my own."

have you checked the suzuki faqs :o

I wanted to do this but could never find a box at the right price.

I have a 16v corsa sri box, but i'm not sure if the casting is the same.

kev

[Hayling mini]

Hi Kev
Have emailed Walden regarding their product, looks like it is for F10 or F13 box. Will post their reply when I get it :lol:

[Swiftmini]

yeah please do!

i'm certain the kit was advertised on the website with a price of around 200. I think there was a pic of the kit also. I will see if I saved it on my harddrive.
cheers matey

[Swiftmini]

walden eng is now called clarke motorsport

kev

[Domcr250]

Just had a look at their website, no links for conversion kits?

Dom

[Swiftmini]

that's correct ! I think its special order only.

i'm using f15 from corsa sri. will add pics later.

kev

[Swiftmini]

clarke won't do me a kit!

gonna try and do it myself whilst I save for a frame from 16vshop.

kev

[MattG]

thought about this before .. i would go for the vauxhall small block frame if doing this , you would then only need to make 1 engine mount , job done... using the vuaxhall shafts ...

as the other 3 mounts come off the gearbox ( which is vauxhall in this case) ok could not gurrente engine position , but you would be easier , and you will not get the vauxhall gearbox any further back anyway

Matt

[Swiftmini]

yes matt that's what I was thinking! if I have little room i'll clubby front it.

shame the subby and shafts cost 1200+ gonna take me untill christmas to get cash.

I need engine management aswell!!! LOL

Kev

[pob]

1300 16v swift engine complete with vaux g/box for sale on this link.
The guy is in Dumfries which doesn't really help you guys :lol:


http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=107193

[Swiftmini]

Bill faulkner has got the adapter plates, but after speaking to him i maybe changing from suzuki and finding an alternative.

Plates are 100 quid

Kev

[ed4ran]

but after speaking to him i maybe changing from suzuki and finding an alternative.

Do tell!! :D :lol:

[Swiftmini]

Well its only really another hear say situation, i wasn't going to start an argument on here about how good or bad certain engines are.

Basically he said he has been doing suzi for 10 years and these days he wouldn't bother. He reckons that as soon as you want more and start lifting the rev limit it will start to destroy valve seats. Solid lifters just shouldn't be used on these engines on the road. Bill reckons he is always rebuilding heads mid season on these engines.

If i get rid of all my suzuki bits i will probably make some money back as its alot harder to et the bits theses days.

If i had any other engine i could have gone and bought a throttle body and ecu kit and had my car running years ago. You can't even get a four branch off the shelf easily.

Basically why go through all the pain to get an f13 box onto my g13b engine and then into a mini when i can get better results (for less money) from the 1400 ecotec that the f13 box came from.

I know this will start a war and everone will think i'm stupid but for what i want my mini for and the fact i need to virtually start from scratch. I may as well put in a 1000cc a-series.

I will revive my for sale post as soon as i know what i'm selling.

Cheers
Kev

[ed4ran]

Yeah i know what you're saying
I do find myself wondering about other engines, but that might just be for the fun of trying to fit something different, or see what i could squeeze in.

The hardest part seen to be finding dimensions of the different engines as not many put them in completely different cars.

Suprised you havent looked at nissan engines if thats what your into.
Have wondered about the SR20 (seems to be in a few cars) but dont know any dimensions.

:?

Ed

[Swiftmini]

Funny you should say that Ed. I have a Ca18det on my shed floor. It came from my 200 but i think i melted the rings as it lost compression.

I can get measurements from both the ca and the sr motors no probs.

The only problems i see are they are all getting old and unreliable these days and also they are heavy lumps.

I think at the end of the day i will have more fun with my mini if i stuffed a 1275 in it, than the amount of enjoyment i get out of it at the mo.

As soon as i blow a few a-series up and have got the mini bug back i'll probably want 16v something again. lol.

Cheers
Kev

[Swiftmini]

What does our mid engine mini handle like.

what are your opinions on front engine rwd setups??

Kev

[ed4ran]

Not really ever put it to the test, :oops: After some tweaking etc it then went into mums garage while i started my job, then bought my house and now all my money has gone into getting my house sorted :?

I've started looking at mini stuff again though, and im comtemplating what i should do, dont know whether to keep with the layout ive got, go for the awd setup of the swift / justy with the engine in the front,
or try a front engined rwd setup (i was looking at this before i was nudged into mid engined). It certainly looked do able with a swift engine, but ive been trying to look into the strengths of the box, and alternatives to it.
Dont know what other engines would be worth trying in this layout (bike engine ? :wink: :lol: ) but there aint much room without chopping out the bulkhead alot. Something like a EJ20 seems to big from the approximate sizes i could find. Even sniggered at the idea of an A series front engined rwd :lol:

After looking into the sr20, alot seemed to say it wasn't the best, and saying more power could be had from an equivilent honda engine.

I going to try and make a front frame that is just tube, not a chopped up old one, it would require suspension arms to be made etc, but would also alow maximum space for an engine.

Ed

[evolotion]

seing as your considering engines, allow me to toss in somehting origional :) .. Front engine rwd volvo :wink: witha suitable turbo ofcource :lol:

[Hayling mini]

Hi Kev / Ed
I think it would be a real shame if you moved away from the G13B, about 18 months ago I discovered this site & both your build diaries helped motivate me into doing one myself. I chose the Suzuki option on the back of reading the builds.

I have done extensive research into the different options, take another look at Redline, those guys are spanking the engines everyday in 30 degree heat. Kev you have most of the kit to really make your Mini fly. All you need is a 60mm SR20 DET throttle body, Mitubushi twin turbo injectors for the inlet manifold. Forged pistons are £100.00, really good Turbo manifold £300.00 that will fit under a clubman front. TD04 off ebay £100.00 max, you already have megasquirt.
Ed you are talking to Andy & my god does he know his stuff, once again you have most of the bits you need, get the 1.6 gear ratios & some advice from Andy & I guarantee you will be more than happy with the performance. Ask Andy to take you out in his, my god is it quick :D

Jerry

[ed4ran]

the 5 cylinder T5? :shock: That looks pretty big!! Would probably be easier to get a v6 in due to the 3 cylinders long. :lol:

[evolotion]

was thinkking more of the older school 4 cylinder lumps, theres quite a few goung around with proper crazy big power :) however, you prob should just finish the car as is and enjoy it while you build your next :)

[ed4ran]

Yeah I really do like the engines. Suppose i sometimes just want "new" things just because they are "new". I do have more knowledge of the swift setup and parts i can use, so my car is most likely going to stay swift

It would be good if i could get a 1.6 box with the prop shaft and rear diff as AWD does appeal (after seeing whats going into yours) and with a tube frame i recokon i can get it in the front (working on the engine in the back is a major pain in the arse :( possibly as i didnt make enought parts removable from the frame and the seats dont tilt forwards.

My worry tends to come from the idea of when id need a new gearbox etc would i be able to find one? I cant even find one now to start with!!!
I can see references to the 1.6 awd on ebay, but its usually for clutches or exhausts, never actually seen the car though :? and before i looked into this on Suzuki4u and they said there was no difference from the 1.6 awd to the 1.3 awd :? as at the time there was a couple of people breaking cars with the gearboxes.

Ive even been looking into the Baleno, but they say the 1.6 of that is the same as the 1.3 justy box (isnt that supposed to be the same as a normal 1.6 box internals?)

Ed

[Purtsi]

I'd be interested too to know more about swift 1.6 gearbox suitability with g13b engine. Please, do share your wizdom about this guys ;)

[Hayling mini]

Hi Ed
The box you want is from a 1989 / 1990 Swift 1600 4wd, GL or GLX models are the ones I have seen. Maybe these boxes were fitted to the Vitara or other later models, I am sure somebody could let us know. They are not easy to find but do come up & the boxes are supposed to be bullet proof. Given time I will find you one & will also get a spare just in case.
The ratios are a lot better than the GTI, I went out in a 200BHP Justy with the 1600 internals & we were doing 85 MPH at just over 2000 RPM. The Justy / 4wd gearbox is a lot bigger than the 2wd GTI box so will be a tight fit in the front of a roundnose. Going Clubman would help & give you space for the Turbo at the front. You could always buy a complete Justy for about £500.00. I have a spare Viscous as i am not using the standard one, I also have a central LSD (viscous) that Atchi got me.
Everything you could imagine for tuning the G13B is available from Australia at reasonable prices. DMWDave from Redline is fantastic for getting anything you need, Summit Racing are great too.

If you bought a Justy I am sure you could take the wings off & weld the complete front end including Bulkhead into the Mini. This would mean you would not need to buy a subframe as you would use the original & it would all fit under a Clubman front if you sat the Bulkhead 80mm further back. Weld the rear Justy suspension mounts, rear floor panel into the Mini too, all you would have to do is get the prop shortened to fit.

Food for thought
:D

Jerry

[Swiftmini]

Kev you have most of the kit to really make your Mini fly. All you need is a 60mm SR20 DET throttle body, Mitubushi twin turbo injectors for the inlet manifold. Forged pistons are £100.00, really good Turbo manifold £300.00 that will fit under a clubman front. TD04 off ebay £100.00 max, you already have megasquirt.

I already have 440cc supra injectors, ca18det and sr20det throttle body and i have got 2 x TD04. Oh and a grp clubby front :rolleyes:

You are right though, i shouldn't just give up. I haven't been looking into different engines for the project just looking for ways to have it on the road instead of the chicken run. lol.

Its my enthusiasm thats the problem.

Ed i want a tubular frame as well, i have access to a pipe bender now damn my enthusiam.

Kev

[Swiftmini]

Where did the pistons and manifold come from at those prices?? DMWdave??

[miniswift]

Hi Kev,

Pistons were mine.
I sold to Jerry for how much I bought it for.
When exchange rate get better go to ebay USA and you will see set for about $180 delivered to UK with set of rings. Those pistons I got are from Japan also so they are OK.

Cheers
Atchi

[Swiftmini]

Ahh i see

Iam able to bid on the yahoo japan auction site!!

What am i looking for??

I can get them shipped cheap as my mate imports stuff in containers!

Kev

[Hayling mini]

Hi Kev
I have a set of pistons you can have for £100.00 delivered. The Manifold came from DMWDave when the pound was a bit stronger. I also have a Turbo manifold the same one Ed has which I am not going to use. just think of the shocked faces when you pull away from the lights :twisted:

Jerry

[OzMidnight]

Just use the 75mm Vitara pistons. Plenty of guys making 250hp+ from them on turbo G13B's, reliably.

And yes, plenty of n/a G13B's here running hard in bad temperature zones without constant rebuilding.

The Vitara box is different to the box you seek. It's a 4WD, not an AWD. Transfer cases are involved. Swift boxes have always had strength issues, when coupled to big power G13B's.

I'm surprised no Mini guys are using a G10 with a turbocharger. At 70kg, the base engine is quite light.

Make sure your tuner knows that they are doing, or you will break things constantly at that level, like rods and pistons.

[Hayling mini]

Hi Ed
PM sent on 4WD gearbox for sale :D

Jerry

[ed4ran]

:shock: Replied 8)

[Swiftmini]

I would be up for having those pistons, do you take paypal,. Are they vitara.pistons?

I,ll have a look for manifold prices, I was going.to use turbine tech before.

Kev

[Hayling mini]

Hi Kev
They are the ones Atchi got for me, I ended up being given another set with perfect circle rings. The manifold is in this section:

http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9504&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=60

I will take Paypal, cash, IOU whatever.

Just get back on with your build so that I can enjoy looking at the pictures

Regards

Jerry :D

[Swiftmini]

I will have them pistons for my spare engine, I will build a turbo lump for later on.

I pulled out the old carb setup I was using before, going to try that out with ford esc igniton module.

I,ve cleaned up the carbs and manny and I have orderesd new rubbers.

More soon I hope.

Cheers
Kev

Jerry I'll let you know in a day or 2.

[Hayling mini]

No problem, just put some pics up of your progress & get it done for L2B :D

Jerry

[Swiftmini]

No probs matey. I got the carbs out and gave them a good clean. I'll borrow the camera off my missus and get some pics of my mini in its very sorry state.

Kev

Oh i have someone to restore my mini for me for free, all i have to do is get there v8 sierra running. fun fun fun.

[minivalver]

just to let you know, the link that was posted on the 1st page of a guy selling a suzuki engine with vauxhall gearbox is me!!

i have built a nova rally car with a suzuki engine, f13 quiafe box with lsd and different cwp.

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii398/Vauxuki/PC280110.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o95/Greg_Mcknight/PB300025.jpg

[Swiftmini]

are you selling the whole car or just engine and box ect

[minivalver]

i was selling the engine and box..

not any longer though.

[colin66rc]

Do any of you have bill faulkner's number by any chance?

cheers