Rover Metro GTa to Mini Questions....... [Archive]

Dazzler

28-09-2004, 05:50 PM

Ok, just a couple of quick ones....

I have brought a 96 Gta... i was goin to use the engine and all running gear but.... i think its a 8 valve (brought it on ebay... collecting at the weekend).

I have a 1.6 16 valve Mpi out of a Rover 25... will the Gearbox/other running gear off the Gta fit my 1.6 engine?

Also does anybody have any links of companys that do tuning parts for the K, like cams etc?

Oh yeah... this is going in my Van... i intend on keeping std length (cutting the bulkhead side where i have to)... apart from the normal probs can anybody see any others that i may come across!

Advice is always welcome

Daz

evolotion

28-09-2004, 06:33 PM

as far as im aware, you should be able to swap the 'boxes, but they may already be identical (bar the clutch mechanism).

wiring loom will be different however!

with regards to tuneing check out these: -

http://www.dvapower.com/

http://members.aol.com/dvandrews/kengine.htm

both links i believe writen by the same person, but both links given to me through different sources lol.

evolotion

28-09-2004, 06:35 PM

^^^ well by that i meen the milti-point lump shoudl slot in the 8v frame, driveshafts, clutch setup and gear linkage with the metro box :)

Dazzler

28-09-2004, 06:51 PM

Deep joy i didnt read the add properly on ebay for the metro (it had less than a miniute left) and for the money i thought good deal..... then afterwards when i had won it i read the add... it said 96 Gta not Gti... oh well lets hope it has a happy ending.. feeling a little better now

BassAddict

28-09-2004, 07:06 PM

Think the GTa is still a 16v - just single-point instead of multi-point injection (different inlet, ECU and loom)
Rich

Dazzler

28-09-2004, 07:11 PM

thats interesting!!!!!!!

Geehawk

28-09-2004, 07:17 PM

If your 1.6 is complete with box then use it. Its the same as the 1.4 one but stronger. Cut the selector from the Metro box, and use to replace the 1.6 selector if they are not (and they should not be) the same.
The driveshafts should slot straight in.

Do you have the ecu etc for the 1.6?? If not you may be able to use the 1.4 item, but only if it is MPi. And there is the possibility you might have to use the 1.4 flywheel.

Dazzler

28-09-2004, 07:39 PM

the engine (1.6Mpi from rover 25) seems complete appart from box... i have ecu and loom for it....

the Gta is running Taxed and MOTed till next year, lol...£70 bargin...

Geehawk

28-09-2004, 07:53 PM

In that case yes the 1.4 box will fit, but the 1.6 ecu may not be compatible with the 1.4 flywheel (the timing mark thingies may be wrong), also if the 1.6 originally had an alarm/immobilisor, the ecu may not work without it.

If the 1.4 is MPi then you should be able to run the 1.6 on that ecu, but not if its Spi.

The Gta does sound a bargain. probably rotten underneath though :P
my Gti was :(

Dazzler

28-09-2004, 08:04 PM

Why will i be running the 1.4 Flywheel... does this have to be changed th match the box?

evolotion

29-09-2004, 12:00 AM

1.4 flywheel has(possibly) different timing marks.

(im pissed) but if ur insistant watch ,my posts, im quietly confident i have sussed the imobaliser issue wity 1.6 engines, tho obviously cannot be certain until i fire up my engine....

Geehawk

29-09-2004, 06:14 AM

The flywheel and ecu are usually a pair. It has marks cut into it that the ecu uses. Different patterns for different ecu/imjection combos.
I'm tee total, but its too early in the morning for me to think of the correct terminology.

Evo, be interesting if you've overcome the immobilisor issue. Keep us informed.

Dazzler

29-09-2004, 04:00 PM

so.. let me get this straight.... i will be using a 1.4 flywheel to match a 1.4 ecu to combat the alarm/imob problem?

evolotion

29-09-2004, 04:48 PM

but that would meen buying more stuff, i.e. another loom and ECU, an dpossibly flywheel to go with a 1.4 MPi ecu! try and se if you can get it running with the 1.6 ECU and loom. if yours is the same as minewhen you trace every wire in the loom it wil be obvious which ones are asociated with the imobaliser, both are black with a white stripe(on my loom) and one earths thro the imobaliser(and a switch on automatics).

the alarm/imobaliser has a few hooks into the fuel pump relay, and the "crank" wire for the starter, from what i can gather from my loom it doesnt directly connect to the ECU, therefore if you sort out the "crank" wire, and rig up the fuel pump relays so there on ignition 2, through one of those switches that cuts the fuel if you crash, then it should run!!

As far as i can tell the ECU itself is not imobalised/disabled with the alarm.

evolotion

29-09-2004, 05:15 PM

yep, jsut went over my notes, both undocumented wires in the loom go to the small conector on the MEMS relay module, and i believe one then goes to the ecu (my bad) hoever, if both these wires go to the relay module, and relay module can make sence of any signals on this wire its safe to asume the signal is very primative, i.e. floating grounded or +12v!

so chances are that whatever combination makes the relay module work(firing up the fuel pump) then it wil also make the ECU work :)

^^^ Hope that makes sence. i have a pinout of the loom multiplug(including what every wire does and where it goes) and the little 2/3 pronged plug that usualy sits under the multiplug :) if yo uwant a copy to give yourself a headstart il post it :)

evolotion

29-09-2004, 05:18 PM

Actually... ignore all that^^^^ i jsut spodded a mistake in my notes :S

Dazzler

29-09-2004, 05:53 PM

mm.... sounds like you have had fun with this one.. think i will get it mounted first and have a crack at getting it started with the 1.6 gear... would like to keep this post open if any knows of any more problems with my plan.

Thanks so far boys...

Dazzler

05-10-2004, 08:28 PM

Ok... the Rover 100 has arrived.... think this is going to get sold on... never thought i would say it... but this one is too good to break...so going to flog this one and get a wreck in... anybody want it £450

ChadH

05-10-2004, 08:32 PM

Why don't you take the engine out, and sell the car without an engine. One of the guys did that here with a Honda.

Chad

Dazzler

21-10-2004, 03:40 PM

because its a metro!!!!! nothing worth anything on it without the engine, just brought complete front end of GTi so i defo have no need for it lol..... back to project....

picKup

24-10-2004, 06:11 PM

I had a quick thought today? Did you say the engine was from the rover 25? If so it could be like mine and be a twin coil pack engine and so no distributer. If this is so I would of thought only an ecu from a similar rover engine will work! sorry

Mike

Dazzler

24-10-2004, 07:14 PM

yes it is out of a 25, but i havent really looked at it yet, i think when i have the old girls body preped for a subframe then i will worrie about the engine, wanna get it mounted first and drive shafts made

Dazzler

21-04-2005, 11:15 PM

WOW has it been that long... well progress has been slow, but the body is nearly there, about to start mounting engine.....

Drivehafts are my new worrie, i want to run mini subframe and track anybody know where i can get the shafts made? if not i will have to opt for putting the mtro frame in.

Oh i kept the GTA lol, my old man has been driving it every day till the tax ran out at the end of last month, now he has brought a mini and wants to put that engine in so now my project has got more steam with him haslling me all the time

HELP PLEASE

Picadilly

22-04-2005, 01:37 PM

i had a quote from watsons daz. they said to make a dummy shaft by welding the various min/metro bits together and send it to them, they will use this as a template and machine a complete new driveshaft for you :)

bit pricey at 150 a shaft tho...

I believe if you have a shufty round the forum search theres a couple of threads about shafts, im pretty sure MBE in lincoln was mentioned, seemed a bit more reasonable than watsons, altho i believe this option is a 'cut and shut' type shaft, not a new one piece thing.

other than that i'm stumped mate, wait till somebody who knows more than me come along.... shouldn't be too long! :lol:

As you know i'm using the metro frame, and if you've seen the lotus van in last months miniworld, you'll know that can be modified to fit if you can get creating with the radiator mounting!

evolotion

22-04-2005, 01:45 PM

I'd go the metro frame personally, unles you have resons for sticking wihtthe mini one (already got wheels and brakes and expensive suspension bits sorted)

From what others have said its alot more stable at speed, doesnt tramline. torquesteer etc.
you get ready made shafts and engine mounts. modern suspension components, (modern ball joints, no more shimming!) only reral trouble is sorting the rear track to suit. IMHO ofcource.

Dazzler

22-04-2005, 03:49 PM

Geehawk

22-04-2005, 03:51 PM

Theres every possibility the hubs could be converted to Mini PCD, but I hate to think how far mini offset wheels on a K series frame would stick out :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

MarkLD

22-04-2005, 03:52 PM

Yes, the hubs can be converted but your wheels will have the wrong offset

Dazzler

22-04-2005, 04:03 PM

Hey mark, was it you i met at silverstone? (i was the dodgy bald bloke that ripped the shit out of Mivic falling apart)

Yeah..been slight change of plan, i have 3 k series engines and 3 minis to put them in (mine, the van and my oldmans)

what i do with the van doesnt really matter as i have to buy everything for that, but for my car and my oldmans (the ones we are doing first) already have everything but the enigne in, if you get where i am coming from.

So i would like to use the mini wheels, and one car has 6x13s on and the other has 7 x 13

Pictures of my car http://www.minifinity.com/hotornot/top.php and at www.staffsminis.co.uk

Dazzler

08-07-2005, 05:08 PM

Hey all me again...

ok, going with the metro frame and i have it upto the van, it looks like it will fit under std front (well nearly think i have to trim the exhaust maifold some).

to get the frame far enough back i have to remove the metro steering rack...

Ok, to all those that have done this, what have you done used a mini one on the body or had the frame further forward and used the metro one?

Help about to start making mountings to fit the frame.

P.S still trying to get it under std round nose front, will worrie about cooling later..

BassAddict

08-07-2005, 07:09 PM

All uses of a rover 100 frame I've seen have kept the rack as standard I'm afraid ! :(
Rich

Dazzler

08-07-2005, 08:07 PM

yeah that wont work unless i take the floorpan/baulkhead back some, as i need the bar of the back of the frame on the mini baulk head to get it far enough back to fit under std front

anybody else got anythoughts?

peskett

09-07-2005, 11:14 AM

Only probs i could think about if you take the subframe to far back would be the alignment on the wheels in the arches. I was looking at moving the engine back on the rover subfame if only by a couple of inches.

Dazzler

09-07-2005, 11:18 AM

You get everywhere!!!!!!!

it looks liek they will be ok, if i get the back of the frame touching the baulkhead, its the setring rack that looks the prob

GEDI

11-07-2005, 02:27 PM

the rear of my frame is just touching the bulkhead and there is room for the steering rack, needed a new hole drilled for the column to come through the floor.

Dazzler

11-07-2005, 03:38 PM

thats good info, do you have a pic? maybe you have your frame at a dif height to me?

Geehawk

11-07-2005, 03:47 PM

With the Watsons kit the frame touches the bulkhead, but it aint going to fit under a standard round nose, without cutting the bulkhead back by a few inches, and moving the front of the frame back too.