2.0L 16V 4WD Mini Roundnose

[Ozium16v]

Hi everyone, ive just got around to sitting in front of my computer and hopefully making a build diary.
The plan for the project is an all wheel drive 2.0L mini using the Red Top engine, gearbox and fluid tranferbox from a Vauxhall Calibra 4x4.
I completed the restoration of a mini a couple of years back, so have a fantastic bodyshell freshly stripped down and have just aquired an H reg 2.0L 16v Red Top 4x4 Calibra doner car.
I will be attempting to keep the front standard length, design my own frames and may even delve into the black art of suspension design/construction (Ive bought books!?!?)

Here I go, wish me luck :|

[Owen]

Good luck! Post up some pics of the current status! Always cool to see what the car looked like before surgery lol :D

[wee man]

sorry to put a downer on your project but i would do some research into cavalier transfer boxes.

[MK_Bob]

Care to elaborate, wee man? Sounds like a fantastic project, i really hope it's a simple case of cutting and shutting driveshafts and propshafts to get the transmission reduced to an appropriate size. Let us know, and post lots and lots of pics!

[evolotion]

wee man may be touching on the fact there weak as shit, not "real" 4wd and 9 times out of 10 dont work anyway. :lol: however. if teh transfer box is rebuilt and made a bit stiffer, itll make for a very interesting converison. certainly it should be under less stress sin a nice light mini than a c(h)avvy so may work out pretty well.

[Ozium16v]

Ive done the home work, and thanks for the concern, im looking forward to the learning curve :) the transfer boxes arent bombproof i agree, but there are still thousands of cars out there running with 4x4, there is even word of 300BHP C20LET driven cars. If serviced when required and the seals and fluids replaced there isnt much issue with them, its only the boxes that blow the seals that are knackered.
It is also not true that these arent a proper 4WD either, a percentage of drive is always supplied to the rear wheels (20% ish) and up to 99% of drive under certain conditions. The major problem is locking up the rear wheels while the fronts are rotating, as this effectively locks up the "fluid" in the box and over stresses it.

I see the front to rear drive bias to be a great addition to launches and it also adds a touch of weight to the rear of the car, rather than relying on a full tank of fuel.

If all else fails I could follow the mechanical centre diff option :oops:

Cheers guys

[wee man]

they never work thats the problem. Your supposed to run your tyres all matching and make sure they all wear evenly plus cavs and calibras when it works dont wheel spin and puttin 13 inch wheels on, the transfer box even an uprated one wouldnt last five mins and at 1600 quid a pop could work out expensive :cry: plus they work through the power steering and as its all big and bulky, no room for steering rack so it would be a tight squeeze. I would be well impressed to see it done though.

[Ozium16v]

Im planning on putting the rad in the back, so hopefully leaving a bit of room up front, keeping the power steering pump for the box and fitting 16s to try and keep the rolling diameter close to original though the standard length front could be optimistic :?

The car was cheap enough so if it alls fails and bites me in the backside I can always revert to a "simple" FWD.

Is this TX box something anyone else has looked into?

[wee man]

best site for info is www.migweb.co.uk

[Ozium16v]

Thanks WeeMan, spent the week reading, it does look more grim than I thought :(

So far I have mostly destroyed a pretty intact 4x4 Calibra. I may from now on only buy items after viewing them because although the car was advertised as complete but needing a new head, when the car was delivered I found the engine to be in pieces and thrown in every nook and cranny :shock: Not quite false advertising :?

I spent last night removing the rear subframe that supports the rear arms and diff, and removed the propshaft.

One of the blokes at work has let me borrow his engine hoist for the week so the engine/gearbox (whats left in the car) should be out pretty soon. Then its the boring task of selling whats left on FleaBay.

Some pics of the Mini etc. should be posted tomorrow

[wee man]

really wasnt tryin to kill a dream just had my fair share of transfer boxes in the past. And that was when they were loads on the road.

[Ozium16v]

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/DSCF0008.jpg
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/DSCF0009.jpg

This is the mini already stripped down, deseamed and all but rust free. It was painted in black primer just to protect the bare metal repairs while it gets the 16v treatment. I also built a dolly to roll the shell about on, its raised off the floor to allow access to the underside of the car.

[Ozium16v]

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/DSCF0010-1.jpg
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/DSCF0014.jpg
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/DSCF0015.jpg

And this is the 1991 Calibra 4x4 that has donated it engine, gearbox and drivetrain. The rear diff dropped out of the rear subframe leaving a nice compact rear diff that should fit really well in a custom subframe :D

The only problem I have found so far :wink: is the transfer box case interfering with the steering rack position but I reckon this can be rectified by moving the steering rack upwards and making taller steering arms to suit. Ill get some pictures of the engine up against the bulkhead when it stops raining!!

[Ozium16v]

Well, ive not been up to a great deal since getting the bulkhead cut away for the engine to sit in place. Mostly been doing lots of measuring an making drawings to make sure the suspension and steering will fit and work, and to ascertain the best location of the front subframe lower rails.
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/TranferFootwell.jpg
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/Transfertopdown.jpg

I believe the diff outputs are located far enough back and at the right height now, although I have concerns about whether the cam cover will have clearance under a roundnose bonnet because i'm having to keep the engine tilted at 7degrees for the TX box. The purchase of two wings and a bonnet should tell me!? :?
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/Engineinplace.jpg

[mininut]

have you decided where are you going to put your rack mate? :idea: you cant just move it up and extend the arms it'll affect your ackerman and give you horrific bump steer amongst other issues.

[Andy_S]

Could he use a modified Vaux rack, McPhersons, hubs etc? The Calibra rack sits quite high as standard.

[Ozium16v]

Mini rack should go up 80mm and above the TXbox, swap the steering arms from left to right so they point up and in rather than down and in (planing the angle off the top so the track rod ball joints sit correctly), mounting the ball joints upside down. By moving the pickup points of the top and bottom wishbones (i intend to fabricate them) outwards and increasing the track slightly but keeping close to Mini geometry and top/bottom arm length ratios and keeping the track end balljoint within the line of KPI and the rack joint in line with the top and bottom wishbone pickup points then I should be able to avoid bump steer.
Sourcing another rack with the correct width seems more difficult.
I realise that by increasing the track of the car and using the original steering arms I will move my Ackerman point back beyond the centreline of the rear track slightly but this should have a negligible effect if I set the car with zero toe in.

Sorry if you fell asleep through that, and please tell me if the theory is incorrect :|

Ive just spent the best part of a week off work measuring, calculating, remeasuring and planning. Before I get much further with the build I intend to make a full scale model using a Mini upright and rack to test my maths (I dont't trust it either :wink: ) and check for bump.

[Owen]

Mount the mini rack up higher with the track rod ends going into the top of the steering arms rather than in the bottom????

EDIT: posted at same time as your last post. Looks like you beat me to it.


Looking good so far!

[Ozium16v]

I do have much better drawings that i've done by hand with a lot of maths involved but I don't have a scanner and they're a tad confusing, so in case anyone wanted to understand what I intend to do I have knocked this image up quick in the 1st class artists program MS Paint :wink:

I hope this explains better than I could with words??
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn187/Ozium16v/MiniGeo.jpg

[mininut]

i see you've had a think about it then :wink:

M.

[Ozium16v]

Oh god yes, i've racked my poor little brain on this one for about 4days! It feels awful to have acheived nothing but a pile of technical drawings in that time :cry:
But I had to do it before I cut anymore from the car!! The project is a goer :D

[buljac]

Hi there.

Cool project you are running.

I have a 4wd project ongoing too. (have no time at the moment to finish it)

Dont worry about the transfere box problems some one here is telling about.

The major problem that the 4wd is fauling out is due to electrical problem not mechanical. (and this is weary easy to fix compleatly free :P

There is a company in sweeden that is making a kit for the trancfere box that makes it a non electrical unit.
http://www.maxxtuning.se/index.php?id=51
The page is in sweedish but you can contact them and ask for info.

By the way. the different wheel diameter will not be a problem on this setup. LIKE MANY THINK :?
You will only have more tension on the visco coplung.

I talk with good expiriance, I had a tuned calibra Turbo 4x4 that I drow on the track days ( I was the only one that deard) had no problems whats so ever :lol:

Good luck on this.

[peaty_34]

hi

I am trying the same thing, a awd mini using a calibra,
i haven't started mounting the engine or box yet.
but I have fixed engine at a angle problem, trim the edge of the bell housing and make a adaptor plate,;) well i think that will work :confused:
Have you got anymore pics of your progress , am looking forward to seeing the rack mod

[cooper_mark]

think this project is on hold as he hasn't posted since 05-06-2008

[cherrybomb]

Hi mate, hopefully i can spur you on too, i had a calibra 4 x 4 back in the day and yes i had a box fail because i had'nt read about the tyre rotation etc etc and just drove it til the front tyres were bald... I had mine fixed and rotated the tyres every 2000miles, i sold it 30k miles later having had no probs.....

it certainly did work to .....oversteer on demand, you will have an awesome mini..........

[Dazzler]

Some fair old threads getting dug up!

[Oz]

Some fair old threads getting dug up!

At least it shows they are using the search function ;)