Mini-Honda gear ratio

[miccoli]

Hello everyone, I'm a new user, my name is Mark and I live in Rome, Italy.
I'm just building a mini vtec Allspeed frame.
I wanted to just one question:
Where can I find the gear ratio to fit the Honda engine on wheels 12 '?
Thank you very much to all;)

Mark

[Kaison]

Welcome!

For me what you're looking for, these should point you in the right direction!

Here is a list of B series engines, towards the bottom of the page is a list of gear ratios for each type of gearbox; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_B_engine

Once you know your 'box and you've chosen your wheel and tyre then you can calculate what to expect with this link; http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/inforatios.html
http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/inforatios.html

[miccoli]

I have a b16a2 standard Wiky from reading, I have a gear Transmission: Y21 or S4C. From these data, can you tell me where to buy with the right measures? Is there someone who has already installed on this engine?
Thanks

[Kam]

There should a sticker just above your clutch slave cylinder which has got the transmission number on it, if its not there then you can take the gearbox casing off (not hard to do) and count all your ratios

When you got your ratios written down then check it against this - Clicky (http://www.ff-squad.com/tech/temp/Bgears.htm)

I counted the ratios on mine and found my b16a2 box (Y21) had a 4.2 final drive instead of the 4.4 and a different 5th gear so its worth doing, if your changing your final drive then you gotta take this off anyway.......

Watsons do a 3.4 or 3.7 final drive in both lsd and non lsd format, you can easily check to see if you got lsd though, just look through your diff - if you see a bar in the way you aint got lsd, if you can see right through then you do have it, heres a long way round explaining it - Clicky (http://technet.ff-squad.com/how-to/lsdcheck/)

Send watsons an email and he'll give you the prices, mention your outside the UK aswell

Watsons clicky (http://www.watsonsrally.co.uk/html/home.html)

Welcome to 16v by the way :cool: but next time you got a question about a honda mini then post it up in Honda Chat, this section is just for build diaries, capiche? :lol:

[miccoli]

Thanks guys for your advice, these are photos of my gearbox, S4C http://www.ff-squad.com/tech/temp/Bgears.htmand the numbers are unique.the final drive is 4.400 is ok?

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/9845/20111223211500.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/192/20111223211500.jpg/)

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8336/20111223211513.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/208/20111223211513.jpg/)

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8039/20111230192212.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/402/20111230192212.jpg/)

http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/1361/20111230192230.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/638/20111230192230.jpg/)

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/9048/20111230192326.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/85/20111230192326.jpg/)

http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/5655/20111230192343.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/856/20111230192343.jpg/)

http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/2113/20111230192445.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/703/20111230192445.jpg/)


sorry if I missed the location of my questions in the forum.
thanks
mark

[Kam]

You might aswell count up 1-5 gear ratios whilst your there, just to make sure you know exactly what you got and check it against that list

[miccoli]

Hello Kam, I counted the teeth of the gears, the results are the
No.1 15 teeth
for the
No.2 64 teeth

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/6576/20120103201323.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/502/20120103201323.jpg/)


with these numbers you can 'figure out which gear to Watson to ask?

Another question:
- A conversion for mini / honda is better wheel 12 x 6 or 13x7?

thanks Kam
Greetings from Rome

[Freebies]

Can't help with the ratios but for wheels, Go with what ever you want.... You can get final drives on eBay, Watson, and others. First need to choose your wheel size and type it it the site above or other transmission ratio site to figure out the speed you will get at each RPM at any speed...

You will see if the final drive is Ok or not...

This site was given not long ago that takes wheel size in consideration. and draws you a graph that gives you speed for each rpm for all 5 speeds.

http://www.zealautowerks.com/transcalc.php

12" tire are 165-60-12 usually
13" tires are 175-50-13 usually.

Have a look at the graphs using tire size you want...

[Kam]

Hello Kam, I counted the teeth of the gears, the results are the
No.1 15 teeth
for the
No.2 64 teeth

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/6576/20120103201323.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/502/20120103201323.jpg/)


with these numbers you can 'figure out which gear to Watson to ask?

Another question:
- A conversion for mini / honda is better wheel 12 x 6 or 13x7?

Your final drive ain't 4.4, to get ratios you divide the number of teeth by its opposing side, so.....your final drive crown wheel is 65 teeth and the pinion is 15, divide them and you get 4.2 which is the one most people want if they got a honda as its the type-r final drive and some want if they got a honda in a mini, the reverse gear is always 39 teeth by 13 teeth so divide that and you get 3.0 ratio

Check out the picture below to help you count all the other gear ratios, you need to know all your ratios for later....

http://i437.photobucket.com/albums/qq95/HondaQuick/Transmission%20Build/Picture033.jpg

As watsons do a 3.4 and 3.7 then like freebies said you need to punch them into the gear ratio calculator and see how they compare with what your aiming for, try the 4.2 aswell

I know what watsons 3.4 is like with 12" wheels and alot of people here know what the standard 4.2/4.4 is like with 13" wheels, problem is what works for one person might not work for another

Are you looking for short gears or slightly longer gears than you get on a normal car? I wanted the latter as mine is a pure road car so it makes all the gears perfectly useable but another person might not want that?

As for wheel size thats all down to you, if you want a bigger wheel to make use of the standard gear ratios then the downside is the bigger you go the less it looks like a mini, the smaller you go the more it starts to look like a mini again but you will struggle to get the power down and your gearing will be short so you need a different final drive as the standard one will be no good with smaller wheels :(

[miccoli]

thanks, I want a mini road ratio. I counted all the teeth* *
*1 * * * *3,230*
* 2 * * * *2,105* *
*3 * * * *1,458* *
*4 * * * *1,107* * *
5 * * * *0,875 *
Final * * * *4.266
my teeth in red:
[URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/594/67102910.jpg/]http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/3714/67102910.jpg[/URL ]

Y21/S21/S4C seems correct? http://www.ff-squad.com/tech/temp/Bgears.htm

what do you recommend for a mini road can maximize your gears?
what gear ratio you have? thanks

[Kam]

what gear ratio you have? thanks

What year is your gearbox from? As I'm glad you posted yours as when I counted mine from a '1993 model I had exactly what you got! Y21 box with a 4.2 final drive and the supposedly later 99+ Si 0.0875 5th gear!

As for the road I popped in the 3.4 FD and all the gears are more than fine, you can floor first gear with no spin on straights (I even had a lightweight flywheel attached) going from 4th to 5th was a bit too long as the ratio is slightly longer, you could feel that when you change up from redline in 4th

Only downside is your gears are much much longer so once your on the move and cruising on the motorways/freeways whatever you have out there and you floor it in 4th/5th to overtake its not gonna be frantic to pick up, thats the lesser torque of the b16 coming into play here :(

Heres a quick vid of mine with the b16 in and the 3.4 fd not hitting redline which I've posted enough on here (need some new vids!) and some vids aswell in the link

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg258/kambocars1/Rio%20tec%20build%20part%20two/th_1beemer.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/albums/gg258/kambocars1/Rio%20tec%20build%20part%20two/?action=view&current=1beemer.mp4)

http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27127&highlight=ratios

[miccoli]

This is your mini video will Y21 B16A standards?
It should be really good in this way your mini;-)
My b16a2 is from the year 1996.
If you have left the Y21 standard and 165/60/12 tires
I also can leave it this way, without changing the gear ratio?

I would be very happy. :-)

[Kam]

Yeah all the vids are of mine with the bog standard 1993 b16a2 in there, running 165hp 116tq on 12" steel wheels and 165/60/12 a539's, watsons 3.4 fd non lsd, 4kg act lightweight flywheel and a rover 4 speed gearknob! :D

If you have left the Y21 standard and 165/60/12 tires
I also can leave it this way, without changing the gear ratio?

I would be very happy. :-)

I've never ran with a standard Y21 box I've only ever ran with the 3.4 final drive installed in there, I've left the Y21 gear ratios as they are yes but only changed the final drive from the factory 4.2 to watsons 3.4 so this now makes all my gears much longer/taller

I didn't want to take the gamble the standard Y21 box would be ok on mine using the standard gearing once its out on the road because if it wasn't then you can't just pull the gearbox out alone, on a honda car yes but not in an allspeed frame, you need to take the whole lump out - aka ball ache!

[miccoli]

You tell me to change ch 4.2 final is too short? You advise me to or not to change the ratio of 3.4 final Wadson? I do not know what to do. Help ..... Thanks

[Freebies]

He clearly said to leave gears 1 to 5 as they are BUT CHANGE THE FINAL DRIVE.

He is using a Watson Final drive 3.4

you need to determine your needs (race, solo, road, daily driver, etc...)

[miccoli]

Excuse me, I did not understand. :imstupid:
Monday I talk with Watson to buy a 3.4 final drive. ;)
Really, thanks to all.
Mark

[Freebies]

That's ok Mate, Kam has this effect on me too, (making me feel stupid... :lol:)

[miccoli]

This is Watson's mail, 8 weeks are so many. We know one other person who sells the 3.4 final drive?
"I only have 3.7* in stock** 3.4 will be 8-- 10 weeks** cost £495* shipping £40** regards geof"
Thanks

[Kam]

PM monkey on here, he was selling his watsons 3.4 non lsd one a while back, not sure if he's still got it

[miccoli]

Thanks Kam, send immediately an PM ;)

[miccoli]

nothing :sad:
monkey did not more :confused::sad:

[Kam]

nothing :sad:
monkey did not more :confused::sad:

Not sure what that means? is that supposed to say know? that wouldn't make sense either as he was selling one? :lol:

I'll text him

[Kam]

He's a quick monkey!

Yeah he said he sold it a while back, he's the only person I know who was selling one as he was selling his whole conversion at the time, so you might have to order one and wait

[miccoli]

I'm driving always in the city,you think a 3.7 would be fine?
what's maximum speed 3.7 gear ratio?
thanks

[Kam]

I wouldn't worry about maximum speed for city driving! :lol: I'd be more concerned about motorway/freeway cruising speed if yours is a road car

Not sure about the 3.7 as I'm only speaking from a 3.4 point of view, speaking of point of view heres my view

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg258/kambocars1/Rio%20tec%20build%20part%20two/th_vidnight.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/albums/gg258/kambocars1/Rio%20tec%20build%20part%20two/?action=view&current=vidnight.mp4)

Not sure how a 3.7 would differ, hardly any post a vid up of theres with there final drives so you aint got much to go on

[wilp99]

ive just installed the 3.7, but im still putting the car back together, maybee another 2 weeks or so. ill get a vid up when the time comes.

[k20/k24 allmotor]

I got a 3.722 in my Dseries and I love it.:p should be on the dyno in two weeks.

[rosslin racing]

so will bigger wheels ie 14 or 15s help the diff problem in Italy?

[miccoli]

i do not like wait 10 weeks.... : Pissedoff:
I chose to mount a 3.7.: D
where you have bought it? Watson?
for the electrical part as you did? I visto this:
http://superfastminis.com/BDWIRINGHARNESS.htm

[Kam]

Who did? I didn't get the wiring loom from minitec I got the full DTA kit (wiring loom ecu sensors) from watsons, oh and there 3.4

Get some feedback up when its on the road, be interesting to see what the 3.7 is like with 12" wheels :)

[ardonfast]

is this jerry beedels about, soz if so,not sure how to conect diss!!!!

[Kam]

is this jerry beedels about, soz if so,not sure how to conect diss!!!!

I do not understand what that post means whatsoever :lol:

[wilp99]

i swear that dude is on that isht about 1/2 the time he posts

[Freebies]

Or on Crystal Meth...;)

[Kam]

So thats the solution then, take some of that stuff then you'll be able to understand his replies? :lol:

Just remember kids, don't do drugs - because they are expensive

[ardonfast]

i swear that dude is on that isht about 1/2 the time he posts

lol,no dont take any of that put it down to the scotch whiskey,i was sober wen i posted that,p.m in kams box,ile lern how to spell soon,lol all the best,

[Kam]

Yeah I got your PM, I did actually understand it :lol: To answer your question no this one is not, its all good and sounds normal and not like the other recent ones

To the others: you probably need some whiskey to understand what my reply means! :lol:

[ardonfast]

Yeah I got your PM, I did actually understand it :lol: To answer your question no this one is not, its all good and sounds normal and not like the other recent ones

To the others: you probably need some whiskey to understand what my reply means! :lol:

rite on,must have been the fine mixture of languge,i blame my pairents,my frends had commics to read/all i had was scrap minis to play with,been useing a computer for 12 monthes ,i think it shows,lol,best intentions tho,

[wilp99]

nice.. atleast your not under the rock anymore :lol:

[miccoli]

Can you tell me the number of teeth of your 3.7 final drive for produce it in Italy.
: Lol:

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/6576/20120103201323.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/502/20120103201323.jpg/)


thanks