Mini 2000 Öland edition!

[blacksaabrules]

Hi all 16v mini lovers!

Since I allways look at your builds and get inspired, Maybe I can give some good ideas back.

I´m on my way to put the great XE engine in a standard roundnose.

Started with this
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT1246.jpg

Made it road legal and changed it into this
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/Servicebilen-1.jpg
(the gokart isn´t allways there)

Drove one summer with a tuned A series engine :confused:, But too much hanging on this sight and a C20XE engine in the garage made me take the step :-D

Some quick pictures from a little more than a year

First try
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2581.jpg

Engine in, but not quite happy
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2639.jpg

Hood on :D
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2637.jpg

New A-arms
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2736.jpg

Front suspension assembled
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2743.jpg

First push outside the garage
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2768.jpg

Summer pause :( not really planned
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2902.jpg

Up to date pictures
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2931.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2933.jpg

Close!
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2938.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2937.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2903.jpg

So this is what I have created thanks to all of you :mrgreen:

Big thank´s too all good information and good pictures from your builds, hopefully I will get my thumb out of my ass and take the car out on the streets this summer. Working on the electrics right now, really boring, but it has to be done. Then I will continue with the oil and the cooling.
Guess it´s time for a testdrive after that :rolleyes:

/ Erik

[Marcus Nordblom]

tasty:) - Adam Opel had been proud;)

[Birdman]

Well done Erik. Now you have started the build diary I can see how little room you have as well.;)

Those "A" arms look seriously strong.

[Birdman]

Just had a quick comparison of your subframe ( according to the pics) and my one. Seeing as we are both trying to achieve the same result. Both engines seem to be in almost the same position really, however something that Strudel noticed the other day with my frame is that my vertical down post is set at an angle from the top frame rail that is bolted to the bulkhead cross member. There is an angle here. My vertical down post misses the CV joint and should be near to vertical when the car is on the ground.

On your frame you have compensated for not having an angle at the join between the vertical down post and top frame rail, by creating an angle further down the vertical frame rail. You therefore miss the CV joint.

The "A" arms look really nice, but I am wondering how you can set the caster angle accurately on the bottom arms. Is there adjustment for this? One thing XE lovers on here have said is that not only do you need to adjust / setup the suspension well, but the Vauxhall XE conversion likes to have some good +ve caster. Just thoughts ...

[blacksaabrules]

Hmm, been a while since a made the subframe, but I know there is an angle between the car and "ground level" compensated for that and added an extra angle as you could see for the drivshafts. I´ve changed the upright tubing to 50x50 now, thought it looked a little weak with 30x30 as it is on the picture.
Don´t have any good pictures of the subframe, since I rather work on the car than take pictures, and my mind is far away from the camera when I´m in the garage...
Working as an cad designer daytime, so a little "spare" time might have been on my car :rolleyes:
It´s much easier to build in the computer than in real life, have been looking quite a lot on old drawings of mini subframes and compared with the car home in the garage. I´ve made quite a lot of mini drawings the latest year....

Castor angle...... As I understand 3' is a good start, so I started there, but the lower A arms is adjustable in an out individuable (front, rear), so it can probably be more. Upper A arms is adjustable in and out but only in the middle (camber?).
Im not very good in what the different wheel angles is called and what they do, only basic toe in, camber and caster. Trial and error will give the answer hopefully.

Some nice stuff (in my eyes) on the car is:

F18 gearbox with 3,57 FD
Volkswagen passat front ventilated brake discs (fits nicely in 13" wheels)
Wilwood fourpot caliper in front
Huddersfield rear beam
Rollcage
Dummy right driveshaft = equal length on driveshaft
Hydraulic clutch realese
Thermostat housing from an X16XE on the post office, which hopefully will save me an extra cm or two. If it fits :???:

/ Erik

[Birdman]

Thanks for the info. I think AndyS has suggested 6-7+ degrees of Castor angle for the XE front engined conversion. I see what you mean about your bottom "A "arm, you can reduce it's length at the front and increase it at the rear, particularly if you use some slimmer lock nuts.

The front brake setup sounds v interesting. Is the disc diameter larger than 8.4 Mini / Metro?

[blacksaabrules]

The discs are aproximatly 255 mm diameter, They comes from passat 94-96 year model. Real bargain from the breaker.

/ Erik

[Birdman]

The discs are aproximatly 255 mm diameter, They comes from passat 94-96 year model. Real bargain from the breaker.

/ Erik

Whooah that's 10" discs with Willwood Callipers! Any chance of pictures (when you get a chance) with the callipers on?

[blacksaabrules]

:mrgreen: Yes, you have to think a little different when working with mini´s. Lots of ads in carmagasin of big brakes and cool stuff, but it´s all too big :confused:

Really great when you find big mini stuff on standard cars. Quite funny when everything looks perfect at the breaker, but when home in the garage it´s to big...

New caliper holders on the garage floor, so next garage night I will try to mount the goodies, picture comes after that.

/ Erik

[Andy_S]

Castor angle...... As I understand 3' is a good start, so I started there, but the lower A arms is adjustable in an out individuable (front, rear), so it can probably be more. Upper A arms is adjustable in and out but only in the middle (camber?). / Erik

Superb looking conversion Erik & your suspensions arms are very neat :cool:

Once you're driving the brute on the road you might find that 3 degs of Castor gives a very twitchty feeling in the steering. Miglia racing Mini's run with circa 6 degs & with the big Vaux some of us run with more. If you're fitting Power Steering then bigger Castor is not so important, but otherwise it feels like the steering wheel will be snatched out of you hands. :twisted:

[blacksaabrules]

Bugger!! But if I have done the A arms once, I can do them again, with better castor angle. Learning by failure is the codeword obviously.

Thanks for the advice, now I know why it´s wrong the first testdrive (someday in the future)

By the way! Hi Andy, been reading your tread since you rolled your car and rebuild it again, great inspiration.

/ Erik

[blacksaabrules]

Front suspention almost ready, brakes and driveshafts mounted

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2980.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2982.jpg

Looking good to me, slim fit with this brake setup, aproximatly 1 mm space between caliper and ledweight on the wheels.

Have welded the the bulkhead finished and managed to fit the heating system in almost original position

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2989.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2988.jpg

Did find an old picture of my subframe in the camera

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2761.jpg

There are some more suporting welded there today, but you get the picture of the design.

Have found yet another possible cooler to test fit, an old merc 190 2,0!? aproximatly 30x35 cm and 5 cm thick (the 2,3 is 4 cm thick?), must get out to the breaker and buy one.

/ Erik

[Birdman]

Yeah, good pictures. The frame design looks pretty similar to mine. Does it have a fourth engine mount and side frame bars?

[blacksaabrules]

The fourth engine mount is the same as original upper mount.
Frame bars are still in progress, aka the garage floor :D

Does anybody know everything about the C20XE wiring? I think I have all cables under control, but not totally sure.
I have used haynes wiring diagram, but didn´t have all pages :confused: but hopefully the most important ones, some minor headakes left, shall I use the safety fuelpump cutoff relay? Don´t know how to connect it? But it´s maybe just another possible failure anoying stuff ?

Will my old revmeter for breaker dizzy work with the new non breaker dizzy?


/ Erik

(sorry for crappy english)

[Andy_S]

By the way! Hi Andy, been reading your tread since you rolled your car and rebuild it again, great inspiration.

/ Erik

Cheers Eric,

I've taken inspiration from your suspension arms & am currently getting rid of elements of the old AMT stuff in favour of tubular items to give more strength.

The top arm arrangement on the AMT subframe has always been a weakness IMHO & after seeing your design I realised that by sacrificing castor adjustment, then a lot of strength could be added in this area.


Andy
___________

[Birdman]

Cheers Eric,

I've taken inspiration from your suspension arms & am currently getting rid of elements of the old AMT stuff in favour of tubular items to give more strength.

The top arm arrangement on the AMT subframe has always been a weakness IMHO & after seeing your design I realised that by sacrificing castor adjustment, then a lot of strength could be added in this area.


Andy
___________

Can you expand a bit on that Andy? I thought that the rear upper arm on the AMT frame had a tendancy to bend or break , being a cut down tie bar. Is that correct? I have used a cut down tie bar, but then sleeved the tie bar in tube. I hope that's enough.

[blacksaabrules]

Cheers Eric,

I've taken inspiration from your suspension arms & am currently getting rid of elements of the old AMT stuff in favour of tubular items to give more strength.

The top arm arrangement on the AMT subframe has always been a weakness IMHO & after seeing your design I realised that by sacrificing castor adjustment, then a lot of strength could be added in this area.


Andy
___________

I´ve used 22 mm seamless tube with 3mm thickness for my suspension arms.
It´s the minimum to use for lighter cars according to SFRO (swedish amateur homebuild car approval). I was thinking of keeping the forces as straight as possible in the arms and bushes in the small space witch is able to use :D and still trying to make the inside as wide as possible :???:

Hope you understand.

But I ´m thinking of making new upper arms, the camber adjustment is between top of the "A" and upper knuckle joint, so the shockabsorber might take quite some load in wrong direction under acceleration and braking.
Mind error I guess.....

/ Erik

[blacksaabrules]

Frame bars mounted :), hydraulic clutch connected :), brakes on the way and some more wiring done.
Made a connection between the opel gearbox and mini speedocable, will be interesting to see how much it will be wrong :rolleyes:
Starting to smell the end of the project,or mayby it´s just an dream illution.
Must hurry on when I´m feeling this inspiration.

/ Erik

[XEValver]

This is very nice!

I'm envious... i really want my engine to fit under standard roundnose.

I like your brakes too. Are those the Dynalite calipers? How are they mounted to the hub?

I am using those calipers too, with a 10.5" disk. I cannot fit 13" alloy wheels though, but 13" steels (wellers) do fit with just a couple mm spare (the thicker material of the alloy wheels means it's a no-go!)

Best of luck, and no need to apologise for your English. It's better than most English peoples!

[blacksaabrules]

I think the calipers are dynalite, don´t remember exactly :rolleyes:

Borrowed them from a friend, but I don´t think I will ever lend them back, probably easier to buy him new ones.

I made this
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2976.jpg

Sometimes it´s quite nice to work by the computer and have acsess to cnc machines :D it´s actually the third edition......

It became a really close fit

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT2984.jpg

I guess it´s 1-2 mm space between caliper and wheel.

But you have a little bigger discs, that can be the difference and with wellers you have the leadweights on the outside of the wheel, that will give another 2-3 mm space.

The biggest problem with the english is finding the words, have to think a while sometimes, been some years since I finished school.....

Monday night is garage night, will hopefully assemble the brakes then.

/ Erik

[arterz]

fantastic project mate, the front sabframe looking perfect

dimitris

[Andy_S]

More clever solutions, nice one Eric :cool:

[kcchan]

Very interesting build. Its nice to see a new take on problems as it opens up possibilities for others.

Your English is fine and your grammar is better than some on this and many other forums I'm on.

[blacksaabrules]

Thanks !

I had a mini with an A-series lump, I guess you know what I mean.Then too much internet and the idea was born.
I thought if someone else has done it, so can I.

/ Erik

[XEValver]

Nice work there. It is a luxury to have access to CNC! Very jealous.

This is my setup, what you made is much like the blue anodised part that came with my brakes:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e321/Vermiglius/newestbrakes6.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e321/Vermiglius/newestbrakes4.jpg

Keep up the good work.

[Marcus Nordblom]

looking good/ser bra ut;)

we must have a 16v swedish/nordic meet soon:)

[blacksaabrules]

XE valver, yes it´s the nice blue on yours, but mine is a bit reversed due to earlier stupid ideas...... Xe valver, how are your brake hoses in front? Mine seems to collide with the oilfilter on the right side.

Marcus, yes it would be fun, but will your car ever be road legal??
Will hopefully take it to any minimeet this summer, have been stuck in the garage for a while now..... And I live on the backside of sweden obviously, nothing ever happens here :confused: everything is happening far far away..

/ Erik

[Marcus Nordblom]

Marcus, yes it would be fun, but will your car ever be road legal??
going for sfro this year,

failing that we can have a meet at my place, friendly cop area:)

[blacksaabrules]

going for sfro this year,

failing that we can have a meet at my place, friendly cop area:)

We only have some random copcars here in summer, parts of öland still think copcars are black and white :D

Will call sfro after first testdrive so the car will hopefully be on the road (legally) this summer....

/ Erik

[blacksaabrules]

Have made this little thing

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3010.jpg

Whitch make it possible to use an shorter oilfilter, that wont collide with my lower A arms

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3017.jpg

Saved me 25 mm :D

Fixed the right side headlamp

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3011.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3012.jpg

Now the engine and light fit at the same time, just have to connect the wires.

/ Erik

[Birdman]

That's what I have also done with my headlamp bowl ;)

[blacksaabrules]

I´m actually working on my car, but not so many camerafriendly stuff...

Some nice progress

Exhaust
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3033.jpg

Oilcooler with ugly hoses
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3030.jpg

And a C20NE thermostat witch allowes a nice 90 degree hose
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3020.jpg

But it feel like there is half a million little stuff to do before first start and testdrive..

Having problems with the brakes, don´t know if it´s air left or wrong matematics like Xe valvers, http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25233 .

Even working on the fuelpump and fitting the cooler and hoses, so I can finally make that first start :D

Good fun to read about everyones progress. Inspiring, makes me wanna do more and faster.

/ Erik

[blacksaabrules]

It runs!!!! I´m so happy now, don´t know if I can sleep now:confused:, first testdrive will be tomorrow after work.

/ Erik

[Andy_S]

Nice one Eric :cool:

Enjoy your new toy!

[Marcus Nordblom]

Nothing compare to the first test run;)

Don´t smack it in a tree first thing know!

[blacksaabrules]

Will try to make an soft and gentle drive just to feel the car, all wheels are probably in different directions and the brakes are a bit strange. So just a little drive for inspiration today.

/ Erik

[Birdman]

Will try to make an soft and gentle drive just to feel the car, all wheels are probably in different directions and the brakes are a bit strange. So just a little drive for inspiration today.

/ Erik

Well Done Eric! I will be doing a first startup as well this weekend hopefully. Steady on the test drive.

[blacksaabrules]

Both me and the car survived the first testdrive today :D . The engine idles at aproximatly 2000 rpm or so, really high anyway..
But it runs and I´m so happy for my car today. It feels like everything rattles in the car, but that is later problems, first the idle and cooler fan so the engine wont overheat.
The gearbox felt really nice, god speed on every gear, but I have no idea of how fast I was driving (but it was legal speed of course :rolleyes: ).

The car runs soo much better than with the old boring A-series, so worth the work to change engine, atleast today....:D

/ Erik

[cooper_mark]

well done and hope u had fun on your first drive :protest: we need video now...

[spNOam]

Well done! Welcome to the silly grin brigade!

[blacksaabrules]

Will try to make a video, have the bulletcam, but haven´t used it yet. Then I have to learn how to upload it to youtube, I guess it´s not so difficult, but my computer is so old and slow.
Someday I´ll work it out.

Is it OK to sneak out and drive a short trip when the little girls are asleep??:rolleyes:

/ Erik

[cooper_mark]

Is it OK to sneak out and drive a short trip when the little girls are asleep??:rolleyes:


i wouldn't be able to resist........:twisted:

[Mini Vlatko]

Well done Erik! Can't wait to go to my first drive...must be joy of the world! :)

[blacksaabrules]

Long time much work... A bit of a bugger to make the brakes work, and a lot of small things to do, but now almost everything is done. Great feeling:mrgreen:

But the car is almost road legal (atleast for one month) and I´ve been on a mini meeting with the car:D

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3067.jpg

It feels great too drive the car, a bit noisy, but great fun. Have some paperwork left to make it totally road legal.

Another picture just for fun

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii277/blacksaabrules_jaguar/PICT3064.jpg

/ Erik

[Marcus Nordblom]

looking good Erik!

was it happy times on the mini meet? Will deffo go next year,
didn´t have the time too do my car roadworthy

[blacksaabrules]

I was only on the day of saturday, but it´s a lot of friendly people and the atmosfer was very kind and happy.
Will do my best to make a visit next year ( if it´s not up in the northern lapphelvetet;))
Would be interesting to see your car, so get it ready!!

/ Erik

[blacksaabrules]

Yohooooo!!!

My car is now road legal for the next 2 years. :D

Have only been driving 1000km since the summer with the car. It´s really nice to drive with. I think it has a little better power than before the engine swap.

Will update with some pictures some day when the weather is a little better.

/ Erik

[Marcus Nordblom]

nice to hear Henrik! I feel the pressure now;)

[blacksaabrules]

Who is Henrik?? Anyway, you better get your car finished soon. Hopefully next minimeet is nearer your place.

My car weighted in at 775kg, how much does a 16v mini normally weight?

/ Erik

[Marcus Nordblom]

ha ha sorry Erik, alzeimers light:)

i guess weight is depending on engine, wheels etc have no idea what is normal
have you lighten it?

my aim is sub 600kg, not sure what it takes to get there

[blacksaabrules]

No, I made an extra heavysuperduty subframe because I didn´t know better and I know that the car needed to be a bit heavy for the registration. 15kw/100kg is the minimum, but now it was so heavy so I could have 127 kw in the car.... Doesn´t matter, it will hopefully work fine to buy some icecream with the kids :)

/ Erik

[Andy_S]

Yohooooo!!!

My car is now road legal for the next 2 years. :D

/ Erik

Nice one :)


My car weighted in at 775kg, how much does a 16v mini normally weigh?



I got mine down to 680kg without going for Fibre panels.

[blacksaabrules]

I got mine down to 680kg without going for Fibre panels.

Ooop! Almost 100kg difference :shock: Mine is a bit fat then, haha.

/ Erik

[Andy_S]

Ooop! Almost 100kg difference :shock: Mine is a bit fat then, haha.

/ Erik

Yours insn't really a fatso ;)

Mine is stripped out for racing so only one seat, no window winders, no glass except in the front, thin ally sheet replacing lots of the interior panels, small ally fuel tank.

To get below 600kg takes removal of most of the interior trim, lightening steel box section with holes, use of some exterior fibre panels and light(ish) weight wheels.

With the big Vaux Engine up front you don't need to be light as you have lots of torque :-D

[blacksaabrules]

:) Yes, thats one benefit with C20XE, and I guess it´s more fun to port head, change cams ets etc so the engine produces 200 hk than lighten the car.
I have full interior, spare wheel, 35 liters tank and windscreen washer, yeah everything you need on a standard roadgoing car. So it maybe isn´t so bad.
Fun to know the difference still.

/ Erik

[Birdman]

:) Yes, thats one benefit with C20XE, and I guess it´s more fun to port head, change cams ets etc so the engine produces 200 hk than lighten the car.
I have full interior, spare wheel, 35 liters tank and windscreen washer, yeah everything you need on a standard roadgoing car. So it maybe isn´t so bad.
Fun to know the difference still.

/ Erik

Well done Erik and thanks for the weight info. I'm adding weight by the day. How is the car behaving? Is it easy to live with on a daily driver basis?

Cheers.

[blacksaabrules]

Well done Erik and thanks for the weight info. I'm adding weight by the day. How is the car behaving? Is it easy to live with on a daily driver basis?

Cheers.

Yes, its quite nice to drive. Have to change the ratio on brake pedal because I think its a bit heavy to brake, the brakes are good, but it feel a bit unsecure when I need to push so hard, probably just spioled of how easy a modern car is to stop. And the steering have been heavier too, the dream of corsa electric power steering is on :rolleyes: but on a later date.
Otherwise it´s really great, I have a astra diesel gearbox and it goes away really nice on every gear, revs about 3000 rpm in 110km/h and uses about 8,5 liters per 100km, my only cars that runs so cheap :)

Have to mount some extra bonnet straps, the bonnet looks quite scary in +160km/h...

/ Erik