D16a9 in the mini cooper (1991 year)

[chargeur]

Hi every body, and happy new year.
I just start my D16a9 swap in my mini cooper.
It's 1991 cooper year. It's a carb model.
I choose the MTD subframe kit, I buy it soon ;)
I have a lot of work, the chassis is not good and sometime i can find the rust.
I think a play with the welding ;)
And now, I show you my pictures about my project.

[chargeur]

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7655/dsc09670r.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/2358/dsc09669.jpg

I buy it like this. She's so tired ;)

[chargeur]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/3508/dsc09671a.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/6473/dsc00013z.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/281/dsc00021ea.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/7806/dsc09896y.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/772/photo0065e.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/2186/photo0195.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/5236/dsc09837.jpg

The Honda D16a9

[chargeur]

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/8237/dsc09924g.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7711/dsc09840o.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6835/dsc09839s.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/9974/dsc09838.jpg

[Freebies]

Be carefull when ordering the MTD kit! Mine came with 2 different length Drive Shaft (cardans). Just what i need for my built. But on your pictures, i see the drives shaft are almost the same size. Do you have a bolted shaft in the back of your engine like the B series (B16, B18) ?

If you don't tell Minitec you won't get the right parts and will be Mad.... Shipping cost a fortune so make sure they know when ordering! Send them a pictures about those and your engine and tell them to take good looks at those picture!

[chargeur]

exactly Freebies, you are right.
My big question is for my Drive Shaft.
Yep, i have a bolted shaft in the back, like the B series ;)
Because i have a friend, he build the same swap like me ( D16a9 engine) and he use the MTD subframe, and he have a big problem with the Drive shaft.
The solution for my friend, he's take out the bolted shaft.And after, he put the same drive shift like yours(with the long and smal parts) on the D16a9,But they are not work good.( trop de jeux au niveau des cardans)
I take a picture and i show you to day.
I don't know if i can use the same drive shaft like the B seies ???
I ask to Minitech for this problem.

[Freebies]

In my point of view, you will need either a B series frame kit or the MTD kit but with B series shafts.

Be aware when ordering !

[chargeur]

I think to, but i don't know if the B series shafts are the same ?

[chargeur]

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/3365/photo0311u.jpg
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/8129/photo0313.jpg
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6307/photo0307c.jpg

[Freebies]

i would suggest you to take them appart and measure them up. Measure only the middle shaft (the part pictured with the Minitec Kit). NOT the Inner CV and not the outter CV.

Measure both to see if they are the same length.

Call minitec with those measurements or post a thread on the Honda Section asking for length of B series Honda shafts.

You'll get your answer

[Freebies]

By your pictures, i deffinatly think you need a B series frame kit, not a D.

This engine looks a lot like a B16 to me even if the number says D16. look my build diary. You will see what a D series looks like (especially the valve cover).

[chargeur]

i think like you ,but i search the right question. The D16a9 are the same bulk like the B series?
for the valve cover, because it's a twin cam to.
I call Mintech and I send the pictures about my engine.

[strudel]

By your pictures, i deffinatly think you need a B series frame kit, not a D.

This engine looks a lot like a B16 to me even if the number says D16. look my build diary. You will see what a D series looks like (especially the valve cover).

It does look similar but is a D16 in any case. There are both SOHC and DOHC D16 engines. Here in USA/Canada it is the D16A1 from an 86-89 Integra. These engines in EDM/JDM have a D16A8/9 designation. I believe down under they might be a D16A3.

EDIT: A lot of the Honda folks here get a JDM ZC blacktop engine which is similar to the D16A8/9 and comes from a 89-91 Civic with the valve cover bolts on the outside. The D16A1's have the valve cover bolts in the middle. The EDM 87 CRX's had the similar engine to the Integras over here.

They all have even length axles but a bit different than the B series from what I know. The intermediate shaft is a bit different in the B series. Click the following link and it will take you to a thread about axle variances. Scroll down a couple of pictures to see them. Then two posts further down it shows the differences in the intermediate shaft.

This board is just for 84-87 Honda Civics and CRX's and their swaps and builds. Usually B16/18 and the D16 variation swaps. JS

http://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=42884&view=findpost&p=434512

[Dowz]

Firstly its definitely a D series, DOHC as covered by strudel,

I have kept the intermediate shaft bolted to the back of the engine and both my shafts are the same length. Call minitec and make sure you are getting driveshafts the same length, they will also know if they are the same as the B series shafts. I would split the inner pot joint and count the splines on the driveshaft with the spider on, so long as this is the same as minitecs and they are equal length then all will fit. see pic for the splines i mean to count.

http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk310/dowzmini/dsmod.jpg

As long as your spiders fit their shafts then you can use your pot joints and all will be well. Hope this is helpful.

Why has fitting unequal length driveshafts caused your friend a problem?

[chargeur]

Thanks a lot guy's for your information.

Dowz, for my friend , he have a little problem, because he use the driveshaft D series minitec. Yep, the driveshaft Minitec D series, it's a long and short shaft. And he take out the bolted shaft, for use the D series minitec drive shaft.
And the Dseries minitec move a little bit, isn't good.

[chargeur]

I call Minitec for explan my problem. and i send a pictures about it to minitech.
I tell you guy's when i have one answer.

[Freebies]

I know it is a D series by the number but my point was it could need the MTB instead of the MTD kit. If the engine is Shaped more like a B, maybe all mounts and fit would be like a B and not a D.

This is why i think it should use an MTB kit. At this price, you better check twice!

[strudel]

Freebies,

I now get your concern. You are correct about the difference in the drive shafts. The SOHC D's have unequal length shafts whereas the DOHC D's have equal length units. The mount orientation will be similar to the B series on the timing side but without seeing the tranny side of chargeur's engine I can't say for sure.

The D16A1's have a front mount on the tranny and the B's a top mount. I don't know for sure on the A8/9 versions. There may also be a difference in the rear mount between the A9 versus a B series. You are correct to advise him to be sure of the correct mount system for the frame ordered.

I would send pertinent pictures to Minitec for confirmation from them which frame it is best suited to. Otherwise the engine may orientate in the frame but the mount locations either may require refit or different mounts used on the engine/tranny combo. Lots of variables in engine swapping. JS

[chargeur]

Ok guy's,
I send a mail today at Minitech, with my D series pictures.
I waiting now, i hope to have an answer ;)

[Freebies]

Don't put your expectation too high as i found they NEVER answer their e-mails... Unless you give them a call to say: " I send you an email with pictures of my engine can you advise me on wich kit to use..."

It's been like this for me with Minitec. But they are great help on the phone!

[chargeur]

ok Freebies, I call tomorow, it's better you are right.
I forget to tell you, about my friend he make the same swap like me.
He have a problem with engine mounts with the MTD subframe.

[Freebies]

you can call them now as it is 1h35 PM here in Montreal and in Georgia USA where they are located.

[chargeur]

I call Minitech to day, and the guy say to me :send me a pictures, and i tell you after ;)
I wait now one answer by mail.

[Freebies]

haven't you already send the pictures before you called ? Loke yesterday or wednesday ?

[chargeur]

i send a pictures wednesday, and i call to day.
But the guy tell me send again my pictures to day.

[chargeur]

I use the MPI mini tank and i pute the Honda gaz pump on it

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/4641/pompeaessence2.jpg

[chargeur]

the connectic are better

http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/281/newconnection2.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/2965/assortimentsfreins.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/34/photo0228.jpg

After:
http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/3791/photo0332t.jpg

[woodyking]

looking good! keep it up!

[chargeur]

Thants Woodyking.
Yep, i finish the rear frame.

[Mini Vlatko]

I always like to see something freshly built...nice work ;)
Although I have to mention that shoes are placed on wrong sides...they have to be fitted like on the pic above...but the pic is upside down :)

[chargeur]

You can see a right and the left side on the pictures. It's for this maybe you think it's wrong side ?

[Mini Vlatko]

I'm pretty sure that the bottom pic is right side back plate and from the looks it appears that shoes are placed wrong...check in Haynes to be sure ;)

[chargeur]

Thanks, you are right. I check it.
I learn in the same time ;)

I'm pretty sure that the bottom pic is right side back plate and from the looks it appears that shoes are placed wrong...check in Haynes to be sure ;)

[Freebies]

Have you prdered your frame from minitec ? Is it a D frame or a B that is required for thos engine ?

[chargeur]

before, too much dusty ;)
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/8416/freinoriginedgueulasse3.jpg

After
metro hub front, for use the metro balljoint. They are more stronger and no adjustment all the time ;)
But need, a very good make up for with the lower arms and the tie bar.
http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/7237/moyeuxavmtroventil.jpg

New stuff for the brakes ;)for metro vented disc
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/6937/triermtroventilaccessoi.jpg

[chargeur]

Hello Freebies, how are you?
I don't know, yep i call minitech, but they are no answer for me, yep I waiting again ;)
But i learn, the D16a9 have the same look like the d16a1.
You can't find the D16a9 in the USA, but find the D16a1.
Isn't imprtant, i'have not the finances now,for the Frime. I wait, when was better :(
Have you prdered your frame from minitec ? Is it a D frame or a B that is required for thos engine ?

[chargeur]

Oops, I take the wrong way with the picture about my hubs.My steering arms they are not at tke right side.
Sometime, it's not bad to see the send pictures ;)
Now, it's ok :)
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/971/dsc00522o.jpg

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/2328/dsc00466m.jpg

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/5223/dsc00469n.jpg

[chargeur]

Metro vented break
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/975/dsc00572yi.jpg

http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2831/dsc00607b.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/4268/moteurmiseenplace.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/850/tiebar2.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/7286/tiebar1.jpg

[evolotion]

why does your subrame have a lower tie bar setup for the top arm? i have seen people do this for various reasons,(stregnth and to allow for ajustability of anti-squat/lift) just curious what yours were :)

[chargeur]

Hi evolotion, yep my mini is ritired now. Because before I use my mini for the Rally.
And the tie bar on the top arm it's for more Rigidity. like a double Triangulation.

[chargeur]

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9784/berceau4.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/9835/berceau6.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/1110/berceau7.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/2272/berceau8.jpg

[chargeur]

My home frame made.
A lot off work again...
Coming soon,more finish.....;)

[Mini fab]

Good progress my man!!

[mostdef]

looks beautiful!!! great work

[chargeur]

Thanks a lot Guys :D

[chargeur]

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/4991/dsc00873t.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/3897/dsc00878jf.jpg

[Birdman]

There's some nice curves going on there. I will be interested to follow this build..

[chargeur]

There's some nice curves going on there. I will be interested to follow this build..

Thanks guy.
but it's for a D16a9, is not for a Vtec engine or the other D series.;)

[Birdman]

OK, I was referring to the nice tube bends in your subframe, but it may have got lost in translation.

[chargeur]

OK, I was referring to the nice tube bends in your subframe, but it may have got lost in translation.

thanks guy :D
But i have a lucky for build my subrame man, because it is thanks to all guys on this site.that I was able to make my chassis.
And it is for this a like this site, yep the exchanges of ideas with the other guys .
Thanks for all.;)

[chargeur]

http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/176/dsc00875.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/7823/dsc00880i.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/7307/dsc00881m.jpg

[peaty_34]

hi how are you going to mount your bottom arms as the two bottom tubes are not running parallel with each other so the pivot points will be different, so the arms will be different lenghts, nice to see someone using tube though

[plastic rules]

hi how are you going to mount your bottom arms as the two bottom tubes are not running parallel with each other so the pivot points will be different, so the arms will be different lenghts, nice to see someone using tube though

Bottom arm and tie bar mounts are already there and done :confused:

[chargeur]

My bottom arm for the tie bar, are parallel.
It's my curve left and right, they are a little bit different, the distance are more shorter on the left, and is for this you think my bottom arm are not parallel.
Trust me, they are parallel ;)

[chargeur]

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/62/dsc00885fnl.jpg

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/8325/dsc00903pe.jpg

http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/9316/dsc00892u.jpg

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/8892/dsc00891xy.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img574.imageshack.us/img574/522/dsc00925.jpg

http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/1806/dsc00921a.jpg

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/533/dsc00923ta.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/5324/dsc00930l.jpg

[minidream94]

Looks a nice build my friend :D what car is the engine from?

[chargeur]

it's a civic 1991 year.

[chargeur]

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/5868/dsc00967q.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1037/dsc00998p.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/3998/dsc01008xj.jpg

[Birdman]

Wow that's very neat and tidy. I'm in the middle of doing my bulkhead box fabrication at present. Is it best to grind down the welds to get a really good surface finish? I worry that by smoothing the welds I will be removing strength.

[MINIMAD30]

If possible u can weld the rear of ur bulkhead box aswell, that way u can buff the welds down with a flap wheel disc and not loose weld integrity. On my bulkhead it is all curved and smoothed off, have a look at my build and u will see. I like this subframe, Im going to make a tubular frame next. Keep up the good work!!

[Owen]

Wow that's very neat and tidy. I'm in the middle of doing my bulkhead box fabrication at present. Is it best to grind down the welds to get a really good surface finish? I worry that by smoothing the welds I will be removing strength.


Sorry to hi-jack, but in most instances (full pen welds being the main exception) approx 80% of the weld strength is in the cap. Why it's cringe when people grind back welds on subframes.

Would probably be ok on sheet (provided you get full penetration) as it's easier to get good penetration. One thing to look out for is plate misalignment on joints as when you go in with the grinder afterwards to "flush it off" then you can end up removing thickness from one of the plates (evident as the plate going "blue" when it almost breaks through).

Again, apologies for the hi-jack.

Build is looking good dude! Keep it up :)

[chargeur]

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/3182/tabliermodifier.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/5075/groupephotosfaceavant.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/9040/montagechassisphotos.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/8582/compositionrough.jpg

[Birdman]

Bulkhead looks like a work of art. Superb. The other pictures, are works of art.:D

[chargeur]

Thanks Birdman, I would like about my projet look like my draw.

[chargeur]

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/7924/componoirblancfaceav.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/8410/moteurchassiscompo.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/3869/compo11032011.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/6439/compof.jpg

[Birdman]

Lookin Good Monsieur.

[chargeur]

Lookin Good Monsieur.

Thank's mister Birdman.
You speak French?

[chargeur]

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/4955/compostableaudebord.jpg

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/2936/compou.jpg

[chargeur]

http://img808.imageshack.us/img808/8827/21579219580580379165210.jpg

[Birdman]

http://img808.imageshack.us/img808/8827/21579219580580379165210.jpg

Putain de merde!

[chargeur]

Putain de merde!

Tu parles bien français ;)
Or maybe, funcking bullshit ;)

[chargeur]

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/455/18193718720407465182510.jpg

[Birdman]

Tu parles bien français ;)
Or maybe, funcking bullshit ;)

Unfortunately not a French speaker yet. I used to work in Malesherbes in Paris 1 week a month and have worked with clients on engineering contracts in Paris as well. I'm going to have to learn some French, because my Parents have moved to somewhere near Poitiers and are building a house out that direction. I hope to take the Mini over to France soon.:D

[chargeur]

Unfortunately not a French speaker yet. I used to work in Malesherbes in Paris 1 week a month and have worked with clients on engineering contracts in Paris as well. I'm going to have to learn some French, because my Parents have moved to somewhere near Poitiers and are building a house out that direction. I hope to take the Mini over to France soon.:D

It's similar for me with my English.
I learnt English when i was in Canada on Toronto.
Make I signs if you come France with your mini there.

[Birdman]

It's similar for me with my English.
I learnt English when i was in Canada on Toronto.
Make I signs if you come France with your mini there.

Oui - especially on the Champs Elyees / Place Charles de Gaulle and take out a few Gendarmes.;)

[chargeur]

Oui - especially on the Champs Elyees / Place Charles de Gaulle and take out a few Gendarmes.;)



I take care of the Gendarmes ;).
If you come France, it's with your Opel mini ?

[chargeur]

I take care of the Gendarmes ;).
If you come France, it's with your Opel mini ?

Sorry Vauxhall Mini ;)

[Birdman]

Sorry Vauxhall Mini ;)

Yes, with the Vauxhall / Opel Mini.

[chargeur]

Yes, with the Vauxhall / Opel Mini.

It's domage that my mini is not finishes. It would have been able to be nice. I shall be currieux to see yours. I find her it nice. :)

[Kam]

I like the funky way you've posted your pics up :D but whats thats bar with the slight bend for in the bottom two pics?

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/4955/compostableaudebord.jpg

Is that just a support bar or something?

[chargeur]

I like the funky way you've posted your pics up :D but whats thats bar with the slight bend for in the bottom two pics?

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/4955/compostableaudebord.jpg

Is that just a support bar or something?

It is so that the steering column does not move in transverse.

[chargeur]

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/6522/tableaudebordcuir.jpg

[chargeur]

The picture number 2 is the neutral position ?

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/226/sketchalias3bis.png

[Kam]

That bolt in the gear linkage.........is it staying or just there during mock up, if its there to stay I would recommend using the original honda roll pin instead, but I'd imagine its just mock up at this stage

And yes number 2 pic is in neutral

[chargeur]

That bolt in the gear linkage.........is it staying or just there during mock up, if its there to stay I would recommend using the original honda roll pin instead, but I'd imagine its just mock up at this stage

And yes number 2 pic is in neutral

Don't worry, the bolt don't staying, is just for testing.
I stay with the original honda roll pin.
Thank you for your answer.:D