VTEC Perofrmance data?

In looking through the gallery photos, I see a few cars with what appear to be B18c5 (Type R) engines installed. Can anyone comment as to how a Mini with this engine installed drives?

What are the performance (0-100 km) and 1/4 mile times like?

My calculations show that with 200 hp and 1400 lbs, this should be one very quick little car!


thanks,
erik

[B20GT]

Have you ever watched startrek? :lol: Look into the turbo vauxhall nutters on here, I'm sure one has just about popped the 600hp mak( if my eyes didn't deceive me :shock: ) and AMT are gonna apparently use a turbo capable of 1000 ponies, but I cant see the car managing that, or seeing it stick to the tarmac :( Try a B20b :wink: will produce a lot more than a ITR's B18c5, with similar modifications, it has improved torque, and with a set of strengthened sleeves, it can run a meaty turbo, time for one of the more afulent V Tec members to start a turbo project, we cant let the Vaux boys get F/I for themselves :lol:

Ok, I'll try again. I'm looking for feedback from fellow VTEC Mini guys on what a VTEC powered Mini "feels" like to drive.....how much wheelspin, torque steer, etc.

At the same time, I'm trying to quantify the installation with some real world performance data.


I am about to start on my own VTEC installation. Using Brian Campbells' excellent subframe and a MK IV shell.

[JoeT]

I've been looking on the net hour after hour trying to find out the answer to a question that's been bugging me, what should the standard B16a do a 1/4 mile in!??????? :? :?

I know the 0-60 is between 5-6secs, but I'm really interested in the 1/4 mile, as I want to know what kind of time I can expect BEFORE taking it to S.POD, well at least some idea anyway!!

Anyone done it in a standard B16, or can anyone make an accurate, non biased estimate??

Please help me guys! :oops:

[B20GT]

For the hondas/ CRX's its rouphly high 14's

You can expect 1/4 mile times of 14.5 secs, thats provided your reaction speed is better than mine!! i was running 15 secs all day at avon park last year, with a best reaction of 0.85 secs.

But it was my first time doing it, and i still managed to beast a 220bhp BMW cooper S, which made up it. :lol:

also i guess the time will depend on when your vtec kicks in, it seemed like a lifetime waiting to hit that 5000 mark..and then it was all over. good fun though, well worth the money.

B20GT: How is the b20 engine working out for you? I`ve been playing with the thought myself for quite some time now, but first of all the fundings have temporary shortcoming at the moment, and second of all I am a bit concerned on how it will handle gripwise.. my thoughts on this subject untill recently, has been to keep the engine at lowest possible torque, and highest possible hp in the high end of the rpm-register. But maybe this isn`t that big of a problem..My theory behind behind this is to have a engine which is rather sluggish at lower rpms (perhaps mileage friendly too?), and a total monster once passed 4-5000 rpms or so. This requires to keep in the higher part of the register to exploit the power being generated, and minimizing the amount of wheelspin at take off. Maybe not an advantage for drag race, but might be good for ie. circuit racing or road racing for that matter. So can the mini handle the amount of torque the B20 can offer without too much wheelspin? Would be interesting to hear your opinion/experience on this matter..

Kind regards
Chris!

[B20GT]

Sadly chris, and the reason i'm not a member, is cause I don't have my frame etc yet ( will purchase when i return from sea) from my experience with CRX owners/ friends, they are similar to the B18c5(ITR) however once tuned( High comp pistons, rods, crank, cams, valves, springs etc) you are lookin at going to quaife for a limited slip diff, possibly a rebuilt box aswell :idea:

but to run a standard B20b with B16/18 head, you will be puttin down the same as the ITR's, so maby someone with one can answer better :D I'm opting for 14's aswell, the CRX is geared for 14's so i recon it shall be simila( I know the shafts etc are shorter on the mini which shall effect it a bit)

I will be glad to let you know when I get the frame etc and put it in :D

another thing I will suggest, and I have done, is put in strengthened sleeves, or atleast a collar, if you attempt to up compression etc, as the B20 sleeves are the weak point, and tend to crack :(

Scott G

If I `ll go for B20 vtec, I most probably would go for a dart block, so cracking sleeves wouldn`t be a problem :) I figured going with a B20 engine from the scrapyard, it would require some higher compression pistons, and that again would require sleeves as you mentioned, and possibly posting the block and other measures to strengthen the block. So the total cost would be about the same, so it might be just as good to make it right the first time and go straight to the top instead of settling with second best :wink: Might cost a bit more, but I will gladly wait a little longer to get the best there is, as soon as I can afford it. Untill then the b16 will give me the thrills I need :) What kind of frame are you going for then B20GT?

[B20GT]

:lol: I'm not settling for second best :wink: darton sleeves $599, and I have a really good machinest to sort them and the PCV system modifications. Yes I have JE 74mm pistons, with a 12.5 compression ratio. I have a few friends whom have built their own B20's ( Thats why I went for one) and Davy ( The best of them all) carried all the work to his in his garage, he even used a dremmel multi tool to dish the stock pistons( A bit Gettoe, but his output is amaizing for the sheer homegrown ness of it all :D ) I will buy a watsons frame when I'm back and then let the buildup commence. I will happily put you in touch if you wish to learn more about a quality build :D You can also run a b 20 on all standard internals etc, it just means you cant go way into tec :(

Scott G

For that quality build of yours, I reckon you mean 84 mm pistons and not 74. Or else you`d have to fill a whole cm in diameter in the block as the original diameter is 84mm :wink: I was thinking of going for 12.5 CR too, guess it would be OK with regular pump gas. What kind of compression ratios do your friends run? Can`t really compare with the US guys as they run on 92 octane and below, so it`s a bit hard to find out what the maximum CR are for ie. 95 or 98 octane.

What do you mean by using the dremel to dish the stock pistons? Did he just remove roughness, or did he shape them to a more desirable shape?

And the PCV system, I must admit I don`t remember exactly what it is, and I don`t have the manual here right beside me now, but isn`t that the little box attached to the back of the plenum-chamber? And it regulates the idle air based on coolant temperature or something? Or am I mistaken? Guess I will find out later on when I get hold of my manual :) But anyway, couldn`t you just remove it, and fill the whole? Don`t have use for it anyway unless you`re restricted by smog laws..I don`t.. :) Since the car is a 68 model I don`t have to follow so many strict rules regarding smog, noice and other safety and enviromental issues :)

I have been investigating some more into the B20 vtec combination, and it seems like some people don`t like the sleeve-idea, and prefer posting instead. By that I mean threading some bolts into the jackets through the block so it would be connected together and make the block alot stiffer! It also prevents hot spots that might occur when using sleeves due to poor coolant circulation near the block where the sleeves are..But that might be dependant on what kind of sleeves you are using..I guess Darton is a good brand so don`t know if they have that problem..

And you can run full vtec with a standard b16 head, b20 block and internals couldn`t you? The CR on that would be about 10.0 with a B20z block and 9.1 on a B20b, so the CR`s isn`t that dangerous..But you would loose a lot of potential power..As I`ve been told, it is the Compression ratio that kills the B20 vtec combinations if you`re not strengthening the block somehow..

I will happily put you in touch if you wish to learn more about a quality build :D

Why don`t you visit me in Norway and show it to me? :D I actually wouldn`t mind taking a trip to scotland sometime in the future. Seems like a nice place to have a vacation! I`ve been in England, but I haven`t been further north than Newcastle. And I was just rushing through to catch the ferry to Stavanger when I bought my car. Only problem with having a road trip to England is your driving on the wrong side of the road! :lol:

By the way B20GT, do you have closed deck sleeves or open ones?

[B20GT]

Yes my friend, the 74mm pistons was a typing error :oops: :lol: That would mean i was running big mini pistons :lol: 84mm dished forged JE pistons £400 inc VAT from GP Shop in Glasgow, Check my links bit in the links section to get their web addy :D

Dave used the dremmel to get a better shape :shock: and skimmed the head to raise compression I'm led to belive.

As for sleeving it, yes darton is a top american race engine builder, and B20's are there speciality(amongst other american things)

A few of my friends run stadard internals, and yes it is safe, but as you say, it is a waste of potental power. As for which type, it is the only type of B20 sleeves Darton produce, so i cannot say :?

as for going to 12.5, that is purely my preferance as I'm going N/A to start with, if you were to go F/I then I suggest som 10.5 comp forged pistons

I have not heard of these bolts you speak of, and I cant see the problem with hotspots, as it is direct replacement sleeves(Liners) for the stock B20 items :)

I Don't know about visiting norway, but with my job it is a possability I shall one day set foot there, as i am in the merchant navy. Building the B20 is a learning curve for me, as i am used to the old A series, and have just started to learn about the honda units.

The PCV is the "Positive Crankcase vetilation" system, there is a lot of info on this at www.b20vtec.com and www.honda.hybrids.jp hope this can help you, as it is way too much for me to explain :D

Scott G